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MK
05-19-2001, 09:35 AM
I don't know how widespread the news on this case has been, but here in Utah (as you can imagine, if you know anything about Utah history) it is a big deal.

Anyway, just to give a summary, this man in Utah who is NOT a member of the LDS church (Mormon), but a cast-off version of it-- the reformed version-- they just changed their name recently to set themselves apart a little better-- anyway, this man has been living a family lifestyle which the government considers to be illegal. He has five wives (and 25 plus children), whom he lives with all together. The state of Utah has been prosecuting him. At one of his media interviews early on in the case, he explained that his own definition of a family differs from the definition held by the state, and can't understand why they want to prosecute him for merely having different family values.

Although Utah banned plural marriage in its Constitution in order to become a state, it has no specific anti-polyamy law on the books. The news article also stated that this has been the first major polygamy case in the nation in five decades!

Well, yesterday the jury found him guilty. He faces possibly 25 years in prison and oodles of fines.

Sooo... what do you think? One of the attorneys stated that this will cause other practicing polygamists (and there are many in this region, extending into Arizona) to go further into hiding. Something was also mentioned about having a conflict with first amendment rights, and freedom of religion. In a closing statement, Greene states that he never really considered himself to be legally married to any of his wives, and that in the eyes of the government he considers himself single. But, stated Greene, in the eyes of God he considers himself married. Personally, I think that in itself is a conflict of his own religious beliefs, but who am I to judge, eh?

The one thing that I question is, that an apparently very closely bonded, cooperative family unit will be broken up. Is that right, even though the formation of this family may not have been right in the first place?

Another question to think about is, what would have been the result if Greene had been pronounced NOT guilty? Definitely all the people who practice plural marriage in this area would appear more confident when they go out in public, but what about others who currently do not practice it. Do you think there are a lot of men who would like to take on more than one wife, but do not only because it is illegal? Do you think legalizing polygamy would make women more likely to be abused-- not treated as equal marriage partners, like in the "dark ages"?

Jeff
05-19-2001, 12:57 PM
I don't think you can base the validity of a family unit by its cohesiveness. I am sure there are cases of where an adult is involved with his or her child and in the eyes of the involved it may be viewed as A-OK, but...

Did they say whether he was using some or all of them on his income tax returns?

netmechwife
05-19-2001, 04:11 PM
I don't have an answer about the legal side of this. But as a woman I would be sad to have to share my husband with other women. I have a hard time understanding how someone could truly unselfishly and unconditionally love a wife if they have five others or even one other. In my opinion, I would think this would cause division in the family unless the women just didn't outwardly stand up for their feelings on it. Or they just don't think.

Lynda/WA
05-19-2001, 09:41 PM
I wouldn't want to share but think it should be legal IF you can support your own family. From what I understood he was being charged with welfare fraud mainly. Something like 80,000 dollars a year worth of support. I also was of the understanding that the government really only goes after you if there is something else going on like the welfare fraud in this case or cases involving minors and incest. Since he does appear to have commited other crimes I do think he should pay for them. Besides its not as if the kids won't have plenty of *parents*! (Half joking there)
They all looked happy enough in the picture I saw but the houses in the background were pretty dismal. Plus little kids looked like they were wandering around unattended. Just 1 picture though so it may not have been a true indication. My SIL saw pictures of when we went back to WI. The only pictures that had exteriors of the buildings showed the one of the large sheds (house size) and a spare garage to the side. She thought it was my parents house!

jbaxter
05-19-2001, 11:31 PM
I'm sure there is more to the story then i know. there are bound to be lots of men out there that have planted their seed around enough to have had more then 25 kids with more then 5 women. personally I don't see how this can be illegal.

personally i see it as MORALLY wrong but not illegal.



janice

Amy2
05-20-2001, 12:20 AM
If he's not legally married to these women, I don't see how it can be illegal.

I saw a story on these people, and they claim they're happy. The women look like a bunch of stepford wives, and he is definitly no prize in my opinion, but whatever! To each their own, I guess.

Personally, I wouldn't want to share my husband with a bunch of women, but I would love to have a wife myself! Or a couple of them! Imagine all the stuff that would get done around here!

Amy

coulie
05-20-2001, 12:40 AM
I want an extra wife and a couple extra husbands!!!



Coulie

Linda/NE
05-20-2001, 10:10 AM
I guess it's hard to determine how legal this is, but my concern is the multiple partners. If he sees no problem in having 5 wives and the wives don't have a problem with it, what's to stop any of them from sleeping with additional partners. In terms of sexual diseases it sounds dangerous.

TXmom
05-20-2001, 10:20 AM
Does anyone have a link to this story? I'd like to read more about it.

KarlaB
05-20-2001, 10:51 AM
I haven't read anything about this other than what has been posted here, so maybe I am uninformed about a lot of things regarding this case, but my concern lies with the children. :(

Amy2
05-20-2001, 02:50 PM
I read a follow up in the paper this morning, and the creepiest part is that he "married" some of them when they were FOURTEEN! Ick. Throw him in jail for THAT.

Amy

TXmom
05-20-2001, 03:34 PM
I read THIRTEEN!!

kat
05-20-2001, 04:55 PM
I really can't add to the debate here, I've barely caught the news lately, but did catch the "tease" that a verdic was in for his trial. Is this the same guy who married sets of sisters? Years ago this guy was on the talk show circuit with 5 wives all young and they lived in several trailor houses. Seemed "sick" to me. He could have multiple wives, but they couldn't have multiple husbands.

Lynda/WA
05-20-2001, 07:41 PM
Kat - this probably is the same guy you saw on TV. Various talk radio shows said the main reason he is being prosecuted is because he was so visible and had been on shows. Usually it's a case of don't ask don't tell unless their is another legal problem. Here he has welfare fraud. Was this the same state that you can get married at 13/14 with a judges OK? I posted about a story were a very young girl got married without her fathers knowledge after the mother wrote the judge saying the young girl and older mad were a perfect couple. (How's that for a run on sentence!)