OK, am I being too paranoid??

[Suz]

Ok, just wondered if I'm being too paranoid....here goes....
My dd is in kindergarten and they had to make ABAB patterns in one of their learning centers using these little things with pictures on them. Their was a ghost, skeleton, and a devil. Well, I basically would like to throw the devil part of it in the trash!!!! I mean can't they use jack-o-lanterns or something else?? I guess I just don't like that - what do you all think????

[Karen]

It's interesting you mention this...I don't think you're being paranoid, seems like there could be a better choice. With a 2 1/2 yr old dd, as Halloween approaches, I've been thinking, "How am I going to explain these ghosts, witches, devils, skeletons, etc. to her?" For now I'm just trying to avoid it, but they are everywhere, so that won't last long.

[Cathy]

Suz- I would mention it to the teacher. She probably just grabbed some 'seasonal' things for patterning, and didn't think too much about it. I hope she wasn't trying to be offensive. We don't do any holidays because we are hypersensitive (MHO) to families with differing cultural backgrounds.

[arianna]

MM!
Cathy-I'm not sure how the image of a devil is seasonal.

Suz- I would speak to the director about the image. Children can have nightmares over such things.I believe the image is highly inappropriate. ßß!

[Cathy]

Ghosts, jack-o-lanterns, skeletons, witches, devils, mummies....these are the sheets of Halloween stickers that I've seen. I agree that most of these are inappropriate images, especially for small children. My point was that these symbols are pervasive and I'm not sure this teacher was really looking at them individually...though she should have.

[MaryL]

I agree...and I'd talk to the teacher. You're not being paranoid, just concerned. I'm a Kindergarten teacher....and don't use devil as a Halloween symbol. Just don't think it's appropriate for anyone...especially the little ones. I'm really careful to use Halloween "Monsters" appropriately. We read the book called BIG PUMPKIN and it is all about cooperation. There is a witch, vampire, bat, ghost and mummy in the book who all work together to solve a problem. I don't want the kids to be scared of the pictures in the book, and we talk about things being pretend...and just for stories. So far, I haven't heard any complaints, and they LOVE the story.

Just last week I had a parent express a concern about the content in a couple of Berenstain Bear books....I agreed with her, although it wouldn't bother me as a parent. I appreciated her concern, and acknowledged it. I never mind it if parents bring up their concerns and questions. Makes for better communication.

[Amy2]

I think it's all in how you interpret the devil. Is it a red horned guy with a pitchfork? I think of that as impish, as in "that little devil" especially if it doesn't look all angry and mean. I think if you buy into the whole witch, ghost, death thing surrounding Halloween, it's kind of hypocritical to say "well, THIS image is inappropriate but THAT one is acceptable." Or perhaps not hypocritical, but extremely arbitrary.

Amy

[TXmom]

Mary L

You had parents concerned over a Berenstain Bears book?!

And people wonder why I don't want to work in public schools!

[TXmom]

Amy

I don't think people who buy into the whole witch, ghost, death thing surrounding Halloween are the ones who have a problem with any of the other images.

[arianna]

MM! Being a DA, I'll ask again, how does the image of a devil play into seasonal imagery?

I do buy into the whole witch ect. thing and for the life of me have never seen the image of a devil used to celebrate the holiday. Hypocritical , I think not.

Vampires, mummies, bats, skeletons, ghosts, witches and frankenstein, all images used for the consumer holiday we know as Halloween. ßß!

[TXmom]

arianna
Ok, well obviously you buy into the witch aspect, but certainly not the death, right?

You know as well as I do that some people (not me) view Halloween as satan's highest holiday.

[Diane]

Originally posted by TXmom
Mary L

You had parents concerned over a Berenstain Bears book?!

And people wonder why I don't want to work in public schools!

Your kidding... the Berenstain Bears??? I've read all of them to my day care kids and have never found anything that I would consider questionable in them. LOL I guess it's all in the way one looks at things. :)

Diane... :wave:

[TXmom]

Oh c'mon arianna, this could be a great debate but you're falling down on the job!

[arianna]

MM! Nothing to debate. If you follow the thought that Halloween is the high holiday for Satan, I doubt you'd use an image of a devil to celebrate. Never seen the image of a devil used to celebrate Halloween. I think you missed the point of my question.

ßß!

[TXmom]

I totally missed the point of your question. Are you saying that satan and the commercial image of the devil are two different things - because I'd agree with that.

[MaryL]

Originally posted by TXmom
Mary L

You had parents concerned over a Berenstain Bears book?!

And people wonder why I don't want to work in public schools!

....and I'm in a parochial school! Unbelievable. The book in question was Berenstain Bears Bad Habits. The general plot was that Sister went to 1st grade...after breezing thru Kindergarten, I guess LOL...and realized that it was harder work, etc. She starts to bite her fingernails. Well, the parent I am dealing with, questions the fact that this book will worry children that school is going to become more difficult (um....yeah!), and that bad habits are to be expected and almost idolized. I never looked at the book that way...but to each his own, I guess. This same parent had issue with a Arthur book that her daughter checked out from our school library the week prior. In this book, Arthur's Birthday, Arthur and Francine play Spin the Bottle at a birthday party...I think. (Can't say I've read the book recently!) Anyway, the parent thought this was totally wrong for her daughter to check out this book...etc. Again, it's Arthur (you know...PBS Arthur...Millions of Arthur books, toys, etc in the world. LOL) I do respect her concerns....but neither book had anything bad in them. I don't think the Arthur book even had Arthur kiss Francine...he just got all worried about the game. The parent said to me, "Well, I'm sure you can't read every book in the school library...but I'd appreciate it if you'd review the books _____ checks out from now on." No problem. I wish I had the time to read every book! LOL We only allow the Kdg. children to choose from a certain selection of children's fiction and non-fiction books. I've never had concerns like this before. It was cute. This is her oldest child...She'll probably mellow out by the time her last one is in Kindergarten.

[KarlaB]

WOW!!! I have read those books to my dks and didn't think twice about it! Shame on me! :rolleyes: LOL! Let's hope the mom mellows as time goes on! Sounds like you are in the perfect profession with the kind answers you gave her and patience in dealing with someone so particular!! :thumb: :)

[Mickey]

Originally posted by TXmom
I totally missed the point of your question. Are you saying that satan and the commercial image of the devil are two different things - because I'd agree with that.

I personally don't have a problem with devils for that reason. The red suit, horns and trident is the commercial image. I picture that kind of devil on someone's shoulder trying to talk you into doing something naughty while the angel on the other shoulder is trying to talk you out of it. It's not representative of Satan to me either.

That said, I don't see a devil as a Halloween symbol--it's more of a popular costume to me.

[Diane]

Originally posted by KarlaB
WOW!!! I have read those books to my dks and didn't think twice about it! Shame on me! :rolleyes: LOL! Let's hope the mom mellows as time goes on! Sounds like you are in the perfect profession with the kind answers you gave her and patience in dealing with someone so particular!! :thumb: :)

I've also read them to my day care kids. When my youngest dd was little she had every Berenstain book their was and I never saw anything in there I would consider inappropriate or "too sensative". Maybe I'm just not as picky or particular as some but.. I think some people read too much into nothing. JMHO... :)

Diane... :wave:

[Suz]

Ok, I asked the teacher what she thought of the devil face and she said that she thought of it more as being a monster. Well, whatever, it looks just like a devil face with horns and all. It isn't a cute little devil either - I think that it is scary looking. Well, I didn't make a big deal about it. I just thought it was a poor choice. Thanks for all of your opinions. :)

[RCT]

Suz, glad you talked to the teacher about it....no she is aware....


as far as the devil ( red in horn, with tail and trident goes...) ds was that for halloween for three years....I think the costume is popular with the holiday.....ds looked the the deviled ham kid...:lol:

[Diane]

Originally posted by Suz
Ok, I asked the teacher what she thought of the devil face and she said that she thought of it more as being a monster. Well, whatever, it looks just like a devil face with horns and all. It isn't a cute little devil either - I think that it is scary looking. Well, I didn't make a big deal about it. I just thought it was a poor choice. Thanks for all of your opinions. :)

When I was copying off a few halloween coloring pages for my day care kids to color I came upon one of an evil looking witch... I mean she was really SPOOKY looking. (almost scared Me... lol) I'm sorry but as an adult or teacher you should pretty much think of things like that BEFORE you hand them out to little children. I'm sure that if I had made copies of this and handed them out to my kids I would have heard about it from more than one parents. While I think that some parents are too picky and paranoid about some things while other's just don't seem to care or give a darn and maybe should show a little bit more concern than they do. :) I'm glad you talked with the teacher and maybe from now on she'll be a little bit more careful/aware about what she hands out to the kids. :)

Diane... :wave:

[twoin2000]

I disagree with the theory that Halloween is Satan's holiday. I grew up loving halloween costume contests, etc. and feel my kids should get to enjoy it also. I am not a devil worshiper I just want my kids to have fun. My oldest son is in Kindergarten this year and I volunteered to help with the halloween party. I was notified to bring treats on the 31st. A week later I was notified there was not going to be a halloween party, however there would be a HARVEST Party on the 25th. Does changing the day make everything ok for those who don't believe in halloween?

I was disappointed enough when I found out they weren't having costumes for the halloween party. Now there not having a halloween party. When do we stop worrying about someone being offended?????

[Cathy]

Let me step onto my 'educator' soapbox for a moment to answer that last question. I don't think we ever stop considering how the information that we give children affects them (and their families!). It's all in the presentation. Two things spring to mind though.
1. It's not unusual for kindergarteners to be afraid of masks and costumes. Halloween can be a pretty gruesome display for the littlest ones.

2. If your school actually moved the date of the party, perhaps it's because people were offended already, and in showing sensitivity, they changed the focus of the celebration.

If you want your child to experience Halloween in a particular way, throw your own party. JMHO.....and the effect of working full time with children and families of diverse backgrounds.