What's your interpretation?

[Linda/NE]

In looking through the Nebraska regs for a daycare I've found 2 statements that I'd like your interpretation on.


(these are put in my words, not exactly same order of words as the regs)

"If a center has a fenced in yard, any children under the age of 2 must be accompanied and supervised at all times."

If a center has a fenced in yard, any children age 2 or older must be supervised at all times."

Thanks!--I'll explain why I'm wondering later. :)

[AnnW]

You gotta watch the kids in the yard no matter what their age!

[Mickey]

Sounds to me like ALL children, regardless of age, need to be supervised at all times. I'm guessing the reason for the two separate statutes may be that they added the 2 and older one later instead of revising the original one that refers to under 2--maybe they were trying to prevent confusion? (???) Which obviously didn't work! ;)

[RCT]

Children must be supervised at all times.

[Linda/NE]

Okay--
What's your definition of supervised??

[TXmom]

To me it sounds like you must be right there with the children under two - not plop them in a baby swing or something and walk off.

For kids over two it sounds like you could stand of to the side or something and just watch a group of them.

[Lynda-WA]

I interpreted it the same as TXmom. Under 2 includes a physical proximity with an adult. So if you had one adult, 2 under age 2s and 3 kids age 3 and up. The older kids could play in the sandbox , with the tricycles or the swings ect. The under 2s would both need to be with the adult wherever that was.


Supervising the older children would entail knowing what is going on and being able to intervene or help if needed. You wouldn't have to be that close just able to see and hear.

[AnnW]

Ditto

[Jeff]

What is the exact wording?

[KarlaB]

Ditto!! Now, what's the scoop Linda?? :)

[kathleen]

I had to go back and read the sentences, but I think for children under 2 and adult would need to be within arms reach of the children, where for children over 2, and adult just needs to be within the fenced in area. Of course, always supervising, watching, and knowing what is going on.

[Linda/NE]

Originally posted by Jeff
What is the exact wording?

This is what I've found:

Indoor/Outdoor Play:

124. The child care provider shall have knowledge of where each child in care is at all times.

126. The child care provider shall obtain written permission from parents to allow school-age children to engage in activities outside the child care home without direct provider supervision.
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The child care provider must accompany and supervise children under age four in play areas not requiring a fence. Children age four and older must be supervised at all times.

The child care provider shall accompany and supervise children under age two in fenced play areas. Children age two and older must be supervised at all times in the fenced play area.

[Linda/NE]

Originally posted by KarlaB
Ditto!! Now, what's the scoop Linda?? :)

Thanks so much for your responses. I agree completely with what all of you said.

Now, my boss has told me that kids over 2 years can go outside (in the fenced yard) without us being right there with them. We just need to look out the window every few minutes. I found this strange so I asked around and it appears that the other daycare providers in town have been told the same thing.

I feel like my dilemma is more than just whether I will allow the kids the do this when I'm there. Since I'm there by myself most of the time I work extra hard to be sure we're all together. It doesn't bother me so much when older school age kids are outside alone but not those little ones!

What I'm not sure about is if I should be checking with the state office to verify that this is acceptable. After working with my last boss (and she went so ballistic when I did things differently than she did and felt I was trying to change things) I don't want to make my new boss feel that I'm doing that. At the same time I feel I need to look out for the kids first and foremost.
None of the parents have seemed alarmed at the idea of kids being outside without an adult.

So what do I do?? I also don't feel quitting my job right now would be the answer. I feel committed because the boss needs the help so she can take care of her own personal needs. Plus, I do like my job.

Dumb question--- As a parent would you leave your child/ren (between age 2 -5) in a facility that allowed this? I know I wouldn't.

I'd appreciate any insight on how to professionally and politely handle this with out appearing to undermine their business practices. Thanks!!

[KarlaB]

Yikes!! I would not want my dks in a facility like that. I think when they have "supervised" in the rules it means the dks don't have to be right next to you, but I also don't think it means they can be outside alone with an adult occasionally peeking out. We all know things can happen in a matter of seconds and how dangerous and scary for those children. I am surprised the parents aren't more concerned - are they really aware that they are out there alone?? 8o Even though there is a fenced in area would it be possible for a child to be kidnapped when no one is looking? How many kids are out there alone at one time? If there are a lot ~ are the adults doing a quick head count every time they peek out?

Could you contact the state office anonymously and pose as a concerned parent wondering about the rules? From there you could approach your boss if need be?? I don't know. I can see where you don't want to stir things up or question her authority but at the same time have the kids safety/best interest at heart. If it were me I would honestly look into it. What a tough situation! Best of luck!!

[JAK]

Originally posted by Linda/NE


Thanks so much for your responses. I agree completely with what all of you said.

Now, my boss has told me that kids over 2 years can go outside (in the fenced yard) without us being right there with them. We just need to look out the window every few minutes. I found this strange so I asked around and it appears that the other daycare providers in town have been told the same thing.

I feel like my dilemma is more than just whether I will allow the kids the do this when I'm there. Since I'm there by myself most of the time I work extra hard to be sure we're all together. It doesn't bother me so much when older school age kids are outside alone but not those little ones!

What I'm not sure about is if I should be checking with the state office to verify that this is acceptable. After working with my last boss (and she went so ballistic when I did things differently than she did and felt I was trying to change things) I don't want to make my new boss feel that I'm doing that. At the same time I feel I need to look out for the kids first and foremost.
None of the parents have seemed alarmed at the idea of kids being outside without an adult.

So what do I do?? I also don't feel quitting my job right now would be the answer. I feel committed because the boss needs the help so she can take care of her own personal needs. Plus, I do like my job.

Dumb question--- As a parent would you leave your child/ren (between age 2 -5) in a facility that allowed this? I know I wouldn't.

I'd appreciate any insight on how to professionally and politely handle this with out appearing to undermine their business practices. Thanks!!

No, I personally would NOT leave my child at a facility that let my 2-5 yr old outside alone! (And yes, if you are not physically with them and just checking out the window, they are ALONE!)

To me it seems like they lady you work for (and the others in town) are "bending" the rules in their favor. Seems like the reg states that children 4 and over don't have to be fenced in while children under 2 do have to be fenced in. All of them need to be directly supervised. To me that means with an adult outside with them at all times.

I understand because of what happend with your last boss that you don't want to "rock" the boat with this new boss, but she isn't following the regulations. How often do you guys get inspected? I'm just wondering how they've gotten away with this.

I'd do what Karla suggested and just call the licensing agency and see what they have to say about the reg.

Good luck!

Since I live on a military base and am licensed through them we have very strict regulations on everything. But as far as children being outside- no child on base under the age of 6 is allowed to be outside without direct adult supervision. That's for all children, not just dc. A lot of people don't follow the rule, but if they are reported they really could get in a lot of trouble. As far as dc rules- children over 6 can be outside alone with direct window supervision. (meaning I have to be able to see them from my window and have to check on them every so many minutes)

[Mickey]

ITA with Karla and Jen. No way would that be acceptable to me.

I, too, would call and ask for an interpretation anonymously. Only problem is what to do with the info once it's obtained (you KNOW they are going to say that peeking out a window isn't acceptable). Do they know your current concern about this at work? Would a red flag be raised if someone suddenly contacted the facility from the licensing agency regarding this or sent a general form letter to them about it?

I really think it's dangerous and should stop. Hope you can figure out something that can result in it being resolved without you being labeled difficult by your boss and coworkers.

[RCT]

Originally posted by Linda/NE
Okay--
What's your definition of supervised??

an adult is in the yard at all times children are :)

[kathleen]

In your follow-up message you say that you are alone most of the time -- do you mean that you are the only one in charge of your group, or the only teacher at the center? (I am sorry that I don't recall more details of your new position.)

If it is a case of being the only teacher with your group, why would your director NOT want you with the class? If you have other duties, could you and another teacher take turns -- spending a few minutes outside with the children, then spending a few minutes inside taking care of whatever you need to do?

If it is a case of you being the only teacher in the center at the time ... could you lock the front door, take your sign out clipboard out back and wait for parents there?

Again, since I don't recall more details of your new position, I am probably not much help.

However, if I knew that my childcare provider was NOT outside when the children were, then I would have to say something to the director. That just scares me!

[AnnW]

Linda, go to your new boss and say "As you may or may not know, I was looking into opening a center at my church so I had to do alot of research, especially into Nebraska child care laws, and something really concerns me. I don't feel like we are in compliance regarding outdoor supervision..what am I getting wrong here?"
And see how she reacts.

[Linda/NE]

Thanks so much for the responses! I feel better in the fact that we are in agreement with what is safe. Why do I always end up in these situations???



Originally posted by kathleen
In your follow-up message you say that you are alone most of the time -- do you mean that you are the only one in charge of your group, or the only teacher at the center? (I am sorry that I don't recall more details of your new position.)

If it is a case of being the only teacher with your group, why would your director NOT want you with the class? If you have other duties, could you and another teacher take turns -- spending a few minutes outside with the children, then spending a few minutes inside taking care of whatever you need to do?

If it is a case of you being the only teacher in the center at the time ... could you lock the front door, take your sign out clipboard out back and wait for parents there?

Again, since I don't recall more details of your new position, I am probably not much help.

However, if I knew that my childcare provider was NOT outside when the children were, then I would have to say something to the director. That just scares me!

I am working at a small daycare center and when I'm working I'm usually the only adult there. I try to have all the children go in or stay out at the same time. The boss (and her sister that also works there) allow any kids over the age of 2 to go outside which usually results in some kids going outside and some staying inside. It's not really an issue of me staying inside to do things while they go outside. My personal philosophy is that the kids come first and if that means that dirty dishes have to sit in the sink soaking for a little while or blankets and pillows from naptime have to be put aside, unfolded, while I tend to the kids that's the way it is. (My old boss has such fits when things weren't kept in their place! 8o )

Ann, thanks for the idea. I will have to summon up the courage to approach her about this. I think a part of me is just nervous because of how my last boss reacted about everything.