Leigh, tell me more about Germany!

[Brichard]

I would probably place Germany as the number one place I would like to visit. I know that may sound odd, but after studying German language and culture in high school and college... I just want to see it for myself!

I've been told it is a very unionized society. Not many 24 hour places and things close earlier and are not open on weekends as much etc.

Tell me about the foods I should try, sites I should see... I am very intrigued! Sorry for the 3rd degree in the chat room yesterday, but I'd love to hear more about Germany.

I have similar thoughts about Australia, but unless those people are originally from the states, it would be difficult to highlight the differences in living in both places.

[Lynda/WA]

Hope you don't mind if I butt in! I was stationed in Germany (near Kaiserslauten) from 87 - 89. The area I grew up in central WI is very German. All of my relatives spoke a hybrid German/English especially on my Mom's side. Anytime they didn't want us kids to understand they would say it in German. My Dad's siblings all(?) spoke german but only rarely. In fact my first word was in German. But because my uncle (5 yrs older than me) had problems in Kindergarten distinguishing between german and English they all quit speaking it around us. They mainly spoke *Platt* Duetch which is basically a low German dialect. The stuff we had in school is called high German. I can remember going to church services spoken in German.
When I got to Germany it really reminded me of back at home at least out in the country. Rolling hills with fields and forests all in patches. The only place I ever saw a farmer actually behind a plow was in Germany. The towns(towns not cities!) were very different. There could be huge differences. One town may look very modern and another very Old World. If you were in one of the old towns the roads were probably very narrow and curvy. I was amazed at how vehicles could fit through some of the areas! The big cities were similar to those here.
The German houses I was in seemed very clean and plain. Old style water radiators for heat. Emphasis on wood. Wood floors, wood trim, heavy duty wood closets (not built in). I always thought it was funny because you'd see a German out on their hands and knees getting the weeds out of the bricks and know they'd probably keep those same clothes on with dirty knees. The yard and house would be extremely clean but the personal hygeine could be lacking. At least with the older people. The younger set seemed very Americanized. The countryside was very clean too. People didn't leave junk sitting after a picnic.
My roomate and I would visit a pair of older neighbor ladies. My German was/is very sparodic and my friends was nil. The ladies spoke next to no English! It was kind of fun sitting there with a dictionary trying to communicate. We would bring them Chef Boyardee Pizza mix (not available locally) and they'd serve us gelato with wafers. Another friend would give his local friends Lucky Charms since they loved them so much.
Differences in food depended. You could go up to a stand and I'm sure many of them couldn't pass a health inspection. I was amazed at how they would have meat sitting out. If you went to a gasthaus to eat the food was incredible! Something about German fries (pommes) was just better. They ate them with mayo (mit mayo) instead of with ketchup. Infact at the McDonald's we went to you had to pay extra for ketchup. At my favorite gasthaus they would put out a large bowl of fries like we would put out rolls here. I stayed at a German Air Base for awhile. The food there very much reminded me of when I grew up. Of course as I said I grew up in a very German oriantated area. Heavy on the bread!
Big on drinking too (just like central WI). The beer and soda was served at room temp - no ice. Soda would have a twist of lemon added. Alcohol was much much stronger. There was one beer called a Perminator. We called it a terminator! Lots and lots of microbrews. Alot of local socializing was done at the gasthaus. People just sitting at the bar and talking over drinks. Many towns had a brewery. Infact - I think the towns were frequently named after the local brewery. One time we went to a monastary that brewed beer. Really great stuff and I'm not a beer drinker! Octoberfest was one big drunk. Huge tents with rows of picnic type tables. People standing arm in arm with a stien of beer swaying back and forth singing. Carnavel rides and games set up. People running around with squirt guns and toy hammers (the ones that squeek when you get hit). Bad Dirkheim (sp) was similar but with wine. I'm alittle hazy on the details since I was very drunk! Many people would take the train. That in itself was part of the fun but I stayed with friends in the area. Another fun thing was Wine Probing. We went from winery to winery and would go down to the taste room for samples.
The history there was awe inspiring. You could walk through some castle ruins and literally *feel* the sense of history. I've never felt anything like it here in the states. I went on a tour of the Rhine. You went on a boat and sailed past the castles. Beautiful but just not the same as walking around. There was one town that I visited that still was set up to be authentic. You almost expected to glance over your shoulder and see the people. I can't remember the name even though my sister just visited Gemany this winter and went there! I was more impressed by the catacombs in Luxemburg than by the Eiffel tower.

[Brichard]

Thanks for the post! Unless I hit the lottery or something, I don't think I'll be able to go until the kids are in or out of college many moons from now.

I'd hear the room temperature beer thing, but I've also heard that those beers often taste a little better warm.

Did people seem more private? One of my German teachers said people were more inclined to be private and stay in their houses. He said they would think it would be odd if you wanted to borrow something from a neighbor for example.

Basically, he said that in the states we can drive for 30 minutes in most places and "get away" from it all. In Europe where the land is more densely populated... you just don't have that option.

I've also heard that there is a big difference in how facial expressions are treated. I smile and laugh all the time. I have a feeling I would be percieved as being one not to be taken seriously or something. I've been told Germans in general have a more serious demeanor.

It is interesting about the dress comments. I had a teacher in college who was raised in Germany. He said they were more inclined to wear slacks and dress up. He felt they would think American staples like jeans would be considered sloppy.

[Leigh]

Well I will tell you what I can. First off yes they are more unionized. Most things close at 4:00PM on Saturdays and barely anything is open on Sundays.

I haven't been to many differnt places over here, but I can tell you that they like to perserve their land. It is illegal to pull branches off of the trees or pick flowers without permission. Most live in apartments too. There are very few houses due to the fact that they are perserving the land.

Their public transportation is really great. You can go almost anywhere with it. It is usually very accurate too. Very seldom if ever is it more than like two minutes late.

The roads are small is some of the cities which made driving very difficult for me. It didn't help that our car was slightly larger than most over here. They think nothing of parking on the sidewalk or taking up one whole lane of traffic to park. Their cars are usually small, but they do have some bigger ones.

It rains a lot here. Hardly ever a day goes by that it doesn't rain.

When my mom came to visit, she noticed that none of their apartments or dress was bright colored. They stick to grays, blacks, and browns.

I guess I really like the autobaun too. I like to ndrive fast and boy can you drive fast on it.

You are legal to buy beer at 16, but I've never seen anyone carded and know that some had to be under that age. Cigarette machines are on almost every corner so smoking is not a problem for children over here. One thing I hate about the smoking over here though is that there is barely any places where it is illegal to smoke. You can smoke almost anywhere.

That is all I can think of now. If you have any more questions, you can ask me, and I will try to get an answer for you. I hope this helps your curiosity.

Leigh- Happy last day of work and good luck with getting all your stuff ready to move. I know you're looking forward to coming home. What little things are on your "I can't wait to" list?

[Lynda/WA]

Dress - Yes, more people did seem to wear dress slacks and dresses. Since I was 22-23 when I was there some of my perceptions are based on my interactions with a younger set. Plus I've heard that those around the American military bases are a bit more Americanized than others. All of the women I knew shaved. I do remember a sense of blandness but didn't really pay attention to it. After all, I was stuck wearing the exact same clothes every single day. Anything different was better even if it was bland!

The area I lived in predominately had houses. Lots of duplexes. The owner would live downstairs and rent out the other half. I myself lived in an apartment. The neighbors said hi but that was about it with the exception of our little old ladies. My boyfriend lived in a duplex. I can't remember anyone besides myself, my roomate, and those living on base, living in apartments. Everyone else lived in a duplex. I was stationed at one of the smaller bases. around larger bases they probably had more apartments. Plus with the wall coming down they may have built more to house immigrants. I know the local house of ill repute was converted to housing for former East Germans. In comparison I'd place my German neighbors as more friendly than the California ones. Washington next up the list then Arizona. People from Wisconsin as the most friendly. If you want to meet a group of rude unfriendly people go to Paris! I've heard the rest of France is different. One funny story from Paris. I was sightseeing and had people coming up to me wanting to sell me all kinds of things or just being rude. I reached boiling point when this one guy would NOT leave me alone. He asked if I was German and I said Nein, then he asked if I was Swiss. Again I said Nein. He asked if I was French and I said Non. He asked if I was British, I said No. He kept asking as I was trying to quickly walk away. Finally he left me alone and some other guy walks up near me and says something. I snarled *Non* at him. He first looked startled then he and the cop nearby busted up laughing. The poor man had wished me a good day. Very embarrased I said *Enshuligan(sp) Sie mir bitte schone* (please excuse the German I quit over a decade ago). Maybe the Parisians just seemed so bad because I myself wasn't at my best with them! I felt the further south and west you went the more friendly the people were. At the time the wall existed. My roomate said the difference were because those closest to the wall appreciated the American presence the most since many had lived through WWII or at least heard first hand accounts from family. That would all have changed now so I can't really say.

As for the facial expressions bit I'd have to disagree with that. The older ladies we visited were frequently laughing. Could just be my slaughtering the language though! Even when we'd go out sightseeing and ask people (usually old ladies!) for directions they were always animated and very touchy. My parents are members of a German/ American group. One where they have a counterpart region in Germany. I think its called Pommigrants? Anyways, this last year the German party made a trip to central Wisconsin. Not all of the members knew each other. A couple of them mistakenly thought my Dad was a member of their own German party. He's very jovial. I'm guessing your friend was mainly near an academic community? I'd think they would be more serious as a generalization.

If I had to generalize about Germans (especially the older ones) I'd say friendly, cheerful, easygoing, religious, superstitious, and tradition orientated. Old barns in my home area were built round so that spirits couldn't hide in the corners. My Mom collects old German glass ornaments for Christmas trees and many of those have a meaning or even a tradition behind it. For example the Christmas Pickle. Much more preservation of history went on then around here. And it wasn't always politically correct history either. I visited a museum of torture one. I would NOT want to spend a night alone in that place!

On the enviroment - that went back and forth. We had to carry oversized cookie sheets to collect oil drips from our military vehicles. When we deployed in a field we had to bury t.p. and ensure overturned dirt was turned back up. On the otherhand vehicles in the US needed to meet more stringent standards. Many people decided to ditch their vehicles there rather than send them back to the us because of the expense of bringing them up to US standards. (May have changed since). At work we didn't have even a fraction of the enviromental requirements we have here. I'd say that businesses had much less requirements but individuals were much much more aware. Trash wasn't left laying at recreation sites or on road sides. In fact dumpster diving was very socially acceptable. People would set out furniture on trash day and someone would come *recycle* it for their own home. Plus Germans live a different lifestyle that naturally makes less trash. They didn't own much stuff. The Rhine was one filthy filthy river. May have just been the day but I heard the reason they don't drink much water is because their water supply is in such bad shape. I only saw one deer there. It was this dinky little thing that I thought was a dog at first. DH says that the animals are in hurting shape in much of Europe. I guess centuries of major overuse and abuse has left a drastic toll.

[Leigh]

Thanks! Well let's see on my to do list over here:
1) get household items shipped
2) finish buying souviners
3) say good-bye to friends and get addresses



Things to do back home:
1) go to Walmart
2) eat out at a good steak house
3) enjoy the sun!!:)

[Brichard]

Thanks Lynda and Leigh for your information!

[JAK]

Lynda and Leigh described Germany and it's people very well. We were stationed there from 1992-1996 and we loved it! I don't know where Leigh is but we were stationed in Bitburg which is very close to the Lux/Beligum border. There were not a lot of apartments around there at that time. Mostly houses- usually 3 stories and people rented out floors of their house. When we lived off base we live on the bottom floor of a house and our landlord lived on the top 2 floors. She was a sweet kind older lady.

People love to drink there but the one thing that really stuck out to me was that people there were nice friendly drunks ( the older people anyway). Nothing like Americans who get drink and want to fight. They are very mellow.

I sure miss Germany. When I lived there I couldn't wait to get back to the states so that I could go to 7-11, eat taco bell and got to stores on Sunday or even stores that were open late. Well, since coming back to the states I've never lived anywhere that even had a 7-11,
taco bell wasn't as great as I remembered it to be and the store thing, well, I'm really not much of a shopper so store hours don't really bother me.

I hope that someday we'll be able to go back over there even just for a visit. Both of my children were born there and I'd like for them to see the country they were born in. When we left my dd was 23 months old and ds was almost 3 months old.