Pass the Pesto

[Linda/NE]

I've seen quite a few posts from you concerning school age care. What kind of program do you work in?

I own a preschool and daycare center. We have a lot of school age kids this summer. I read through some of the ideas you posted and was curious as to how you keep these kids' interest?
Our kids range in age from 2- 10. The oldest boys we have are around 8. It seems no matter what we plan, they want to complain about it. If it doesn't involve running wild, swimming, and being outside, they aren't interested. Due to ratios we can't go to the pool everyday or we can't take everyone to the pool everyday. These kids think it's just torture to not get to go to the pool. (so do some of the parents )

We have had the basic schedule all summer: arrival - 9 or 9:30 breakfast, free play indoors, etc.
9-9:30 cleanup and "meeting time" At the meeting we discuss the plans for the day and make plans for other special events. Following the meeting we tried having a project but all the older kids (boys and girls) want to do is go outside.
So we go outside until lunchtime.
After lunch it's either water play or movie/nap.
After that around 3 is snack and
then usually back outside.

It never fails, the kids start bugging about going outside shortly after 8 AM. (that's not allowed because there isn't enough staff at that time to monitor both inside and out). One boy in particular came from a daycare where they could come and go outside anytime they wished without supervision outside- just a fenced in yard. We make them wait until 9:30 or 10. Within a hour of lunch time these same kids beg to go back inside. After swimming & snack they're begging to go back outside again even in 100 degree heat. Once outside, they complain about wanting to go back in. You'd think after 7 weeks or more of summer they'd get the routine and plan accordingly.

We have some girls who will sneak back inside and play on the computer and even get into food in the cupboards. (our facility is a house that was remodeled for the center).

My staff and I are getting to the point where we don't know what to do. I'm so tired of feeling like the bad guy because I set the rules and enforce them. According to some of them we are so unfair because we expect them to pick up after themselves. I can understand when our preschoolers constantly want to change their minds on what they're doing, but these other kids are old enough to see ahead that there is a time for indoor and outdoor play and plan their day accordingly.

Do we just have a bunch of spoiled brats (excuse the stereotyping) in our center or are kids just changing so much in this day and age?

I would love to share ideas with you.

[Pass the Pesto]

Good morning!

School aged children can be, and most often are very tempermental. Between age 7/8 and 10 they go through some pretty heavy emotional issues and to keep them level and somewhat happy in my experience has been trying.

My classroom is set up like any other I am sure, with tables for eating and doing arts and crafts. A homeliving area, a carpeted block area, game area, etc. How I operate this room may be what makes it unique. My role in the daytime lives of these children is only as a "group leader" not a teacher or really even an authority figure, since they experience these people all day at school and then at home. I wanted their time with me to be as stress free and relaxing as possible.

To keep there interest, I offer multiple activities which go with our weekly learning goals. I don't direct full class activities, but allow the children to do them as they want. Some play gameboys, some make friendship bracelets, blocks, or in homeliving, while a few will become interest in the activity. I usually getthe interest going by starting on the activity (esterday was salt dough baskets) and they wander over to see waht I'm doing. I also let the activity transform into whatever they choose. Many ended up just making dough blobs(cakes they called them) or other shapes. I let them mix the dough(they love getting gooey- as do I ) and messes don't scare me so I let them get sloppy with it (and hey mine often fight tooth and nail about clean-up too, we just struggle along through it. It's a part of my 'leadership' role I don't find pleasant either).

I also change activities pretty fast, going from crafts to reading about the country we're in, playing an indoor game(like mancala- we got it when we visited Africa a few weeks ago-found at Walmart). I also taught them how to play dominoes and now they are all hooked on that. If I had to think of one thing that really makes my room work I would say it's constant change. It means I have to plan a day in advance at least and have my projects and ideas set up either in my room or in my head, so when I notice boredom I can whip up a change. In a way, they are like toddlers but with bigger bodies, and better communications skills.

As for your outisde time and children sneaking back: have you tried outdoor games? I have some children who loathe outside play, so to make it fun for them we do some team games: red rover, red light green light, baseball, any form of tag, parachute play, etc. We sometimes just stay out in the morning for 15-20 minutes since it gets hot quick here in NC. I completely understand how you feel about the kids wanting to be in one minute and out the next. Frus-ter-ating!

Well, my acid reflux is acting up like crazy this morning so I need to rest. UGH! I have more to post regarding your mornings that I'll post later. I apologize if this post was a little messy and that it is a little incomplete. Will post more soon, or at least this evening after work.

[vea29]

I also have found that the children that went to kindergarden then came back to our day care (after school care) was a challange.

I often through my schedule out the window....I would also at points say to them ok lets come up with some activities you want to choose... and maybe we can agree on one. and if we couldn't do something that they wanted I would explain to them why we couldn't do it...and promise to try another day.

As far as outdoor play....we would set up obsticle courses, or relay races. I also found that the Sprinkler was a life saver...if I just didn't want to let them get that wet...I would take out water bottles and let them go to town. I found that ifIhad fun with them then they had fun too...and time would goo faster.

Good luck!

[Pass the Pesto]

Lovely, I must have a virus. my acid reflux is usually gone by now, but I have been in the bathroom all morning (sorry TMI, I know).

I don't arrive to work until 9:30 and our center opens at 7 a.m. The time in the middle is used for breakfast and free play. I'm actually surprised that the children haven't asked to go out before then(as far as I have been told).

I always hate to get going to early on my projects or I come up short at the end of the day, so I wouldn't suggest getting right intothem thatearly to prevent boredom. I'll have to think more on this.

During the school year the kids have been sitting all day so the last thing they need at a center is more structure. I definitely play it by ear and have 3-4 activities set out for them to try. Also I take on the roleof 'older peer' and totally let go of the authority figure role, and I LOVE this. This is the first year that I will be n the after school room and being going to school. We'll have homework time(we are hoping to open another school room for a stduy room and have one room with centers for the kindergarteners, 1st, and 2nd graders) and I'll act as a tutor and get to do my own studies(yeay!).

The only challenges I have found withthe kinder kids is that they need more help doing things, like getting snack set up, games down, etc. I am so used to being just a body in the room who helps out when needed(I am ALL about them resolving conflict on their own by talking things out) that remembering to give extra care to the little ones is something I deal with a lot. Most of these young ones have beenwith me for a few months and now know the routine, but the ones who will be going to kindergarten in the Fall are still so young to me (I had them in the 3 yr old room last year).
Ok, now I am rambling...

Here is a run down of our routine:

9:30 I round up my sweeties and we head to our room(cheers from kids)
I bring the snack cart in with me. We have two choices usually for snack and a juice. I place cups, napkins, snack and juice on the table and let them get their own. I pour the first few cups to get the juice down far enough so it isn't to heavy to pour on their own. After snack I have two weekly helpers who wipe down tables and sweep up floor. Everyone else rinses out their cups and places trash in the trash can. After snack we have a bit of free play(usually boys start with gameboys and girls work on some craft like crocheting-even some of my boys crochet now!). We have a large carpet in the block area and I will take a few books(about our theme) and just start reading interesting facts. They gradually start coming around to listen and ask questions. We found out that 9 out of 10 Brazilians are Catholic and that started a nice discussion about religious differences and how we all have different beliefs that are our own truth. Very cool. We talked about Carnaval and how we are going to all dress up in wild clothes(the boys wantto wear make up like the drag queens they saw in the picture- again a quick lesson on how boys can wear make up and girls can wear jeans and work in construction) and have parade for our center.

This migrates into talking about other aspects of Brazil and the children who live there, our differences and commonalities. If they are talking well amongst each other, I'll get up and get craft things organized and actually start making something, again a few will migrate over to wear I am, ask what I'm making and I'll give them the scoop, plus a little tidbit on how it relates to our theme. If it is a success the kids will work on this project until lunchtime(and oh it is so peaceful). This is my favorite time. We always get into a great conversation about what's going on in their lives, who is doing what and with whom, the state of the world, etc. Yesterday L asked what Muslim was, and I told him, and that led to other great talks. One of the girls in my class C, who is 10 said, "Ms. Teresa, you make some good points!" She told this to her mom who said...."She does, does she?!" I had to giggle at that.

Anyway...
Noon: We sit down for lunch and chat a little more(I'm all about talking ) and after lunch my helpers start with table washing and sweeping. The other children may choose to get a mat and take it to the block area for quiet activities, or go to a table for a table game(checkers, mancala, dominoes, monopoly, or a puzzle). We have a wuiet play time from about 1 pm until 2:15 since the other childreni nthe center are napping.

2:30 we have our afternoon snack(again they choose from two snack and get their own)
At about 3 I offer outside time if it isn't too hot, and if they don't believe that it's hot, we go out and within minutes we head right back in.

Then I take out another craft or two, set them out on the tables, and explain what they are(yesterday it was dough baskets and an art project using small squares of paper, we also did scratch drawings)

Time usually flies by in the afternoon and at 4 pm I get the overflow of 4 yr olds because we have a teachers who leaves them. It's pretty much free time until 5 pm when we clean up aand get ready to go home.

My job rocks so it seems the days fly by all the time(but occasionaly I do get tired and havea long day).

HTH

[Linda/NE]

Thanks to both of you!

I am a center but it's really like a daycare home because we are in a house. I think it would be easier if same age kids were together. This summer we have one 2 and some 3's so it makes it more difficult to plan activities they all can do.

We don't have and generally don't encourage game boys or playstations. We do have computers but time is limited and they have to share. I have a couple kids who would sit on the computer all day while others it's like pulling teeth to get them to stay inside long enough to eat lunch or snack.

What really gets me is that we've been doing the same routine for 7 weeks or so and there are still some that don't seem to have clue what we're doing. Today, for example we did our usual swimming routine. After lunch, when they are excused, they are to go to the napping room, once everyone is in there we dismiss the girls to change in the preschool room and the boys to change in the bathroom (or vice versa depending on the numbers). So today kids are all over the place. They don't want to sit down. They are constantly asking to change. Finally, before I let anyone change I pointed out this is our usual routine and this is what is expected, etc. It went smoother after that.

You serve morning snack? I do during preschool, but I don't during the summer. We have kids that come in without breakfast as late as 9. (We have a lot of low income families and I think some of these kids don't get fed decent unless we feed them.). If we serve them breakfast, they just pick at lunch and barely eat anything.

That would be nice to come in at 9:30. I agree to start activities before then, they'd be bored by the end of the day. Today I had another staff open for me and I arrived at 8. She had them all outside and NO breakfast yet!! She knew I was not happy! I told her that it gets them too riled (sp?) up and then when it time to cook lunch they want to come in which usually results in messing the lunch room up or bugging the cook so she can't get lunch done on time. I've told her this many times that we don't go outside that early.

Afterschool we have a homework time for those that need it and then it is free choice (outside as much as possible). There is no way we would accomplish any projects or structured things. In the winter we will let them watch a movie. The only lifesaver we've found are fusable beads. The kids put little beads on pegboards in whatever designs they choose and then we iron them. We have to be careful though, because they get bored with them and just make a mess.

Vea, I wish my kids enjoyed the sprinkler. They just don't get into it. My preschoolers do, but not the schoolage.

Thanks again for the suggestions.

[MaryL]

Any way to chop the day into smaller segments??

1/2 hour chunks of time...different activities?? For example:

30 minute periods of reading (library books that are kept at day care... staff reads to younger children, older children need to read to themselves. As the older children finish books, perhaps have them present a short oral report to the other children. Set a goal for a certain number of books read, and them have a reward. Keep a list of the books you've read to the younger children, maybe make a bulletin board that says, "We're hooked on good books" (with a fishing pole, net, etc)

30 minutes daily of group games (tag, dodge ball, duck duck goose, etc.)

30 minutes daily of arts/crafts

30 minutes daily of group time discussions of a weekly theme. (For example, if this week you are learning about ocean animals, this is the time you would talk about this theme)

Do you see what I mean?? Would this be feasible?? I guess I would need to have a very regimented schedule to keep the older kids interested and busy.

9:00-9:30 Group time
9:30-10:30 Outdoor play
10:30-11:00 Crafts
11:15-11:30 Clean up and prepare for lunch
11:30-12:00 Lunch
12:00-12:30 Silent Reading (older kids), group reading (younger kids)
12:30-2:00 Younger kids nap...older kids swimming/outdoor play/video
2:00-2:15 Snack
2:15-4:00 Group games, sandbox, waterplay, etc.
(Just an example....but I'd try to keep it to small chunks of time, and I'd definitately POST the schedule for both the other children and the other teachers to follow. If a child gives you grief, I'd ask them to check the schedule to see what they're supposed to be doing.)

[Pass the Pesto]

Oh I agree it would be difficult to have a wide range of ages in one group- yikes!

Mine are 5-10 yrs old.

I no longer worry about gameboys since the new study has come out Plus mine are much more interested in doing activities overall.

We serve breakfast, am snack, lunch, and pm snack. Plus if we have children going through growth spurts or are a little extra hungry we will pull out some granola, or crackers.

Man, I wish I had some better tips for you. I haven't ever worked with a group with many different ages. Hugs to you though!

IME, getting them ready for a change really helps, for example, "Ok guys, in about 15 minutes we are going to stop doing X and move on to Y." Then in about 10 minutes I'll remind them, so there are no surprises. I do this for clean - up time as well.

Can you do centers? Small groupings of children in various centers doing arts/crafts, reading, science activities? Then change in a 20-30 minute period depending on their attention spans?

What about guest speakers? Fire Department? Rescue Squad?

How many children do you have?

I have 25 between, about 10 of those are kindergarteners, and the rest in 3-6th grade.

[Linda/NE]

Mary & Teresa,
Thanks for your help.

I tried a more regimented schedule last year. We had themes every week. The problems we ran into were that there was always somebody that would be refuse to do them and thus cause the other kids to not want to do them or kids would arrive anywhere from 7 to 10:30. It was hard to plan field trips or outings because by the time you'd wait for everyone to get there, there wasn't enough time.

I use the 5 or 10 minute warning all the time. It usually does work pretty well, it just getting the kids to do anything once we've moved to the next activity that's hard.

I think a big part of my frustration comes from planning for my preschool kids, who can't get enough learning experiences,and then having the older kids who just don't want to anything that doesn't involve running wild or staring at a tv/video screen.
They are wanting to go out to eat at like McDonalds or Pizza Hut, so maybe I'll set up a tour to those places or a special outing.

thanks again!!

[Pass the Pesto]

Man, you have parents who don't drop off until 10:30? We have a policy that states we need kids to arrive no later than 9:30. We do this for a few reasons:
We don't serve breakfast past 8:30, We have snack at 9:30, our curriculum starts shortly after and it is a major disruption to have stragglers. Thankfully we have no problems in this area. Unless a parent calls ahead we really discourage late arrivals.

You older kids sound bored. For field trips we plan a week in advance. We post a note to parents in RED on the front door about field trips. We leave at the posted time onthe door. If they are late, they don't go. If we didn't have staff(although this wouldn't happen) we wouldn't accept the child, and yes they still pay for days they do not attend).

I wish I knew more about your kids, then I could possibly help more.

I think rigid structure is better for preschooler and toddler classes.

Kind of OT, but, what kind of ECE do you have?